disgusting perverts and thugs. First they hid behind religion, now they're hiding behind their barristers. Until we are rid of these cancerous, corrupted and criminalised cesspits of 'orders', Ireland will never be a true republic, and children will never be truly safe.

Any sham that they were truly repentant was laid to rest a few days before the Ryan report was published, in letters sent from that creature Brother Mullan of the Christian (sic) Brothers, denying ALL forms of abuse, and therefore yet again calling the 1,000+ people who had given sworn testimony liars.

Mullan and his ilk had better pray there isn't a God, because if there were, there would surely be a rusty metal pole waiting to impale these sadists, thugs and rapists for Eternity, so that they might begin to know the suffering they inflicted on their helpless victims.

I heard on RTE radio yesterday a story of a very young child who was in the "care" of the nuns (her parents were both alive at the time) when she had some altercation with a nun, who she bit on the hand (as very young children sometimes do).

The next day, that child was taken to a dentist, who removed ALL HER TEETH. The man who told the story to Marian Finucane said all the people involved are still alive and the story is easy to verify.

The witch who ordered this needs to be named and prosecuted. The dentist who carried out this butchery needs to be named and prosecuted. What kind of sickness was Ireland infected with that we allowed this to happen, and let these animals prey on children like this?

I'm so ashamed, even though I did and would never do such a thing to a child, I'm ashamed to live in a country where that happened AND we let them clean away with it. Over and over and over again. The SHAME. God forgive these beasts. I never will.

It was the exact same for Michael Shine, that consultant from Drogheda who sexually abused boys for decades. Nobody would listen to the victims because Shine was a Pillar of Society, well got with the Nuns, the legal eagles and the other local big shots. 

The nuns of course knew all about Shine (you couldn't steal a teaspoon from them without the Superior General being notified) but felt their 'reputation' was far more important than their duty of care to the children in the hospital they were supposed to be running. 

Seeing Shine interviewed on RTE television a couple of weeks ago, what comes across most of all is his absolute arrogance and total certainty that he is Untouchable. He is living proof that crime pays. He criminally assaulted scores, maybe hundreds of children, ruined many lives, yet who cares? His trial in a local court a few years back was a joke, with one "leading" doctor after another, followed by the nurses and the rest, in the witness box to swear what a grand fellow this child abuser really was.

And for the victims? Not one doctor, as far as I know, would speak up for them. And we pretend to be surprised at the Gulag archipelago of criminal abuse that sprung up when defenceless children were imprisoned and put at the mercy of religious orders? 

The only thing that ever really mattered in Ireland was 'good name'. If you had it, you could get away with anything, if you didn't, anything could be done to you and you were helpless, since nobody – not doctors, lawyers, judges, Gardai, priests or civil servants would come to your aid. That much is clear. 

Will it happen again? Absolutely. Leave the powerful with their power intact, and watch as abuse flows from this power.

Thank God it is 2009. And that this has come to light. The damage done to people in this country by "holy men and women", and many people in "authority" is utterly discpicable. I hope, only in the past, but am sure there's still scoundrels out there, preying on the vulnerable to make their own spineless selves feel worth something. I can't think of any Thing to call it. It is what it is. And our only hope is that it wont happen again. Getting them to pay out, getting them to apoligise, "letting them away with it" will all be as useless as eachother. People are damaged. In many cases, I would guess, that the people around those people and the people who have succeeded them are damaged in many ways too.

The learning is the only good thing we can take from this.

However, i would lke to say something. Those CB's, Dr Shines etc, were all children once, like our own. I don't believe in bad nature, but i do believe in bad nurture. Perhaps they felt they had to struggle to be worth while.. "better than"..  "bigger than".. the same way nowadays we like to be "richer than", "thinner than" .. its all an ego thing. 

My point here, is that ensuring healthy self esteem in our children is the only way to never let this happen again, to what ever extent.. be it an institution or a single parent home. Thats quite impossible to ensure, but awareness, at least, is our only hope.

Hi JoJo I think the word (or one of many!) you are looking for is bully. ANyone who kicks or shouts at or does worse to a defenceless child is a bully and  acoward. Put them in the dock and see how brave they are then.

Now lets get after Michael Shine - surely the worst serial sex offender in the history of Ireland - and that's saying something.!!!

Ireland as a nation is gone there is only bullies sex offenders and criminals in it

and the government is as bad. abuse of children is still going on take for instance children with disabilities they are neglected and thrown on the dump heap by our government so of course why wouldnt nuns, priests and doctors indeed anyone who want to abuse children do it they are getting away scots free and are being praised for it. i know of a victim of Michael Shines who highlighted this abuse to a person ( in authority) and he was told to shut up and go away. they should all be charged and brought to justice if it was parents who did this they would be in jail and locked up long ago. jail tham all politions, the lot. they are scum in my books

WE WANT JUSTICE  !!   WHEN DO WE WANT IT  ??   NOW,,,

TUESDAY WILL DO !!!

Isint it a total shame that Michael Shine, is sitting back and laughing, at us,,,

He was supported in court in Dundalk, by quite a number of Persons,,,they SWORE, that he was incapable of the charges against him,,, this was lies under oath,,, and they knew,,, so did a lot more,,,

So did we,,, we knew that he was able to make all his acusers, capable of being branded as "Liars"  under oath,,,

Someone, in the Higher reaches of the Medical Council, had enough rightfulness, to call a halt ,,, AFTER, he had been found blameless,,,

So !!   he was "struck off ".  from the medical register,,, at this stage he was retired,,, on a pension of around €2,000.oo....   yes   

TWO THOUSAND EURO PER WEEK...  

 Thats about a million he has collected in the last 10 years !!!

He will not even allow to answer questions by the media, on his dis barment,, ,,, neither will he admit to the real reason for his removal from the list of medical practicioners, in Ireland

In doing his foul deeds, over the years,,, he totally ignored his

     "Hipocratic Oath",,, which states,,,     first do no wrong !!!   ...

When he swore the oath to tell the truth, in court,,, he and his medical and religuous collegues, branded themselves, as  ""hipocritics"",,, having total disregard for a promise before God,,, to tell the truth...

HOW CAN HE LIVE WITH HIS CONCIENCE  ???

Will next Tuesdays meeting in the DAIL, with the person who is responsible for this continuing disgrace, have any semblance of allowing, an end, to this wait for JUSTICE    ???   Will thee Minister for "Health" ???   be allowed to say,,, YES, I BELIEVE YOU ???    Will there be a starting date for the PUBLIC ENQUIRY,  that is needed  ??? NOW  ??    

 WE ALL WAIT FOR JUSTICE !!   WE HAVE SUFFERED  LONG  ENOUGH  !!

Peter  47             

I agree with all those who were disgusted and appalled by the recent report;  Holy Ireland how are ye!   Land of saints and scholars????    There are a fair number of scholars, i grant, but saints?  Very thin on the ground.   Certainly none in the Government which allowed the religious (?) to get away with their evil, and left us all to pay for it.   Michael Woods, and Bertie, should hang their heads in shame.

I have my own Christian faith, but thank God it is not the Roman Catholic variety!   I am ashamed to admit that I am Irish and a citizen of the country which has carried on such practices for decades - and probably will continue to do so, if the truth be told.

I

While I must agree with all fair and right minded people over the events in our "care" institutions during the past number of decades, is not the shrill voice of condemnation a little too shrill. What was wrong with the plain people of Ireland that they did not, could  not, pass comment while the abuse was taking place.  Very easy to pass comment after the event, easier to look the other way with eyes down while it, the abuse, is taking place.To give an example, during the holocaust of the 2nd. World War, every one knew what was taking place but " I " knew nothing. The time frames are similare, the excuses are the same, and after all the bleating, wailing , sorrow, compensation,reports on reports will anthing really change. I would like to think so, but I am not too sure......

They make me sicker and madder everytime i hear another story about the poor children they battered abused and starved. sisters of mercy my foot they showed no mercy to the defensless children. i was taught by nuns that ran the orphanage in my local area i started school in 1985. i was terrified of them and i only had to be in ther presence for 6 hours a day. even in 85 when hitting school kids wasnt allowed by teachers they didnt seem to care and got my own fair share as well as other classmates of thumps off the nuns. and when my mum confronted them they just patronised her. horrid awful disgusting people they should all be named and shamed and punished for their horrific crimes towards children nuns, priests and brothers.

I think the State was so culpable in all its institutions which committed these poor people to these reformitory places and was so happy to allow others to take up the role for the State that the State should be liable for the greater proportion of the contribution towards recompense .

Imaighean -- don't you realise the problem -- the State is you and me and all of us, when it comes to paying up!    It's the Government ministers of the day who should be boiled in oil, along with the guilty abusers!    But in the end WE will be paying for it anyway!

In this Lovely Little Republic do people now finally realise that it is one Law for the upper crust and the rest can just accept what is dished out. They can kick people to death and their families can afford to hire the most expensive of legal teams, they can have Priests give them character references, etc. We the "lower classes" were created to serve their needs and now that the country is on its needs we again must pay up. One Law for the rich and one for the poor. There is plenty of law in Ireland just not a lot of justice. The Church protects her priests, the Medical Council protects the Doctors and Health Professionals, etc., who protects the working man and his family? certainly not the people elected to run the Country. Right to Life of the Unborn, well I ask what about the right to life of those of us who are in existence here already. Our children, our work colleagues, our old age pensioners, etc. They take the medical card from the over 70's ( or tried to) the individuals who built up this country. our children or a hell of a lot of them go to school each day in run down, rat infested, damp pre-fab classrooms, with toilet facilites one would not find in some third world countries. Need I say anymore, oh yes, then the Ryan report protects criminals by using ficitious names. Will it ever end? I don't think so, this is the Republic of Ireland.

l

Hello Bluebird and all.

Indeed,  THIS,  is not the Republic of James Connolly !

Or any of those who died for Irish freedom !

As can be seen, the differing positions in society, are most noticable, when it comes to justice in the courts,, or any such.

A quick example of this is in a district court report in a local newspaper  ....

4 young lads were out for the night, in a local pub,,, having a friendly drink or 2,,, when the barman turned his back,,, one chap, hid a bottle of vodka, under his coat,,,,,  the group left shortly after finishing their drinks,,, no trouble was aparent.

Some time later,,, the barman, noticed the absence of the Vodka,,, and as there was no one else around,,, he rightly believed the lads were responsible.

Several months later, the 4 lads were summoned to the district court, as a result of the barman making a complaint to the gardi.

4 lads were in court,,, one had a solicitor, and a barister,,, he was a nephew, of a local councilor,,,,  he got ticked off for "boisterous tricks",, other 3 got £50.oo fines, and a blot on their record.

It's not just the top heads of "governance" that use the system,,, but again,,, who can aford a barister, for an apearance involving £30.oo.bottle of booze ??

Same thing goes, my uncle is a priest,,, my aunty is a schoolteacher,,,   the system is used by those who want to manipulate it.

We are all equal, under law, in the "Constitution of the Irish Republic",,,,,  so why is this cary on tolerated ???

If a child is abused by a ' paedofile' ,,, does that mean, as all children of the Nation are equal,  ,,, that all the other children in the family, should line up to take their turn, with the abuser ??

As said previously,,, there is not only one law for the rich,,,,,  ???

There is also absaloutly no connection, between the LAW, and JUSTICE

Has anyone read the Lisbon treaty the whole way through  ???  has anyone read the Ryan Report, I think both are a work of fiction

Regards to all equally ! !    Peter   47

Peter 47 - Well Said.   Can any of the 7% who think the Religious Orders have  paid sufficient try and explain to me why they consider this to be the case.  Also when do the investigations start into the Doctors who signed the Death Certificates for children who died in these institutions.  Did they all die from natural causes?

Bluebird, I doubt if a doctor signed a death certificate.  I think if they murdered a child, they just buried the evidence.   They were omnipotent remember?  Responsible to no one.  

I  cannot believe that there are still people in this country who 'side' with  those specimens of humanity and think they have paid sufficient money towards compensating their victims.   In my opinion every church, convent etc., should be taken from them and sold off, even their cars, golf clubs, etc should be confiscated.  

The People of Ireland at that time would never believe that a priest or brother would do such awful things like abusing children.  They were put up high on a pedestal and treated like gods, which some of them thought they were actually.

De'Valera is the one who created a special place for the catholic church in Ireland, while he got on with running the country he allowed the church to rule the people. 

I do not comprehend how any sane person in their right mind could think for a second that those responsible and all those involved should not face asset seizure and crimninal prosecution. If ANY organisation or company did even a fraction of what they are responsible for, they would face full criminal proceedings including asset seizure. These should not be above the law. The PUTRID EVIL of their SICK horrific deeds are not the acts of any human person or even any animal. They should be named, shamed, prosecuted, their assets stripped and imprisoned so that the pure filth of comtemptible evil can never contaminate innocent children.

Strong words certainly but the Ryan reports catalogs the horror for what it is, a holocaust.

Problem is people do not really change.   They may for a while hang their heads and whisper but when Father ??????? or Sister ????? passes by well its "Hello Father ?" and a great big smile and Hello Sister ?   Thing is that if it were only a small number of religious who were carrying out this terrible treatment of innocent children, then where were the voices of the majority of "good" priests and nuns.   What we must not loose sight of is the fact that the catholic church is not the religion, it is  an institution, the religion is the christian faith  These individuals have done untold damage to that belief.

Well now we know the only way we can get justice for the victims of institutional abuse is to take the law into our own hands, yes - us - the ordinary people of Ireland.   Yesterday Mary McAleese met the victims, said all the right words to give them hope and consolation and today, she did an about turn and met the abusers and told them what a fine bunch they were.   Good people do you feel outraged, insulted, offended to the depths of your being like I do? and all I can think how much worse must the victims feel.   Sr Stanslaus Kennedy who was in one of the worst institutions of them all and says she didn't know the abuse went on was hugged and greeted by Mary McAleese.   Please someone tell me how we muster ourselves to help these victims because you know what? I am now feeling a victim too.   We are all being derided, belittled and used by the Government, the Catholic Church and now the President shows her colours by welcoming Sr Stanslaus and her cronies at the Castle 24 hours after she hugged and sympathised with their victims.    What can we do?    Enough is enough.